Health Innovators
Health Innovators

Episode · 1 year ago

Yes, you can conduct a virtual pilot w/ Jorge Sanchez

ABOUT THIS EPISODE

When COVID-19 flew into the scene, the way we conduct business was changed - virtually overnight in most cases. 

Successfully launching a product was already an uphill battle, now companies had to figure out how, or even if, they could consider launching their innovation.

But can a startup company approach a pilot program from a virtual position, and do so in a way that not only gets them noticed but fuels forward momentum?

According to Jorge Sanchez of Sentinel Healthcare, it’s not only possible to conduct a virtual pilot, but with the right mindset, it can open the door to even more opportunity.

In our latest episode, Jorge gives listeners and viewers first-hand, real-world examples of how to approach virtual pilots and virtual teams in times of crisis - and do so with winning results! 

Here are the show highlights:

  • The importance of data validation (1:50)
  • How actionable, meaningful data can help drive innovation (3:56)
  • Yes, you can conduct a virtual pilot during the time of COVID (5:49)
  • Crisis as an impediment - or an accelerator (10:49)
  • Be the signal, not the rubber stamp, when piloting your product (13:55)
  • Don’t let your company’s end goal get lost in the weeds (17:27)
  • Empowerment is the key to successfully running a virtual team (23:32)

Guest Bio

Jorge Sanchez is Co-Founder and Chief Medical Officer for Sentinel Healthcare.

Sentinel is a digital healthcare company that partners with other healthcare companies to remotely monitor and deliver clinical recommendations to patients with high blood pressure.

Jorge earned his MD at the University of Medicine and Dentistry of New Jersey - New Jersey Medical School in 2003.

If you’d like to reach out to Jorge you can email him at Jorge@sentinel.healthcare, follow him on LinkedIn at Jorge Sanchez MD or, for more information about Sentinel Healthcare and their digital solutions, visit their website at Sentinel.Healthcare

Welcome to Coiq, where you learnhow health innovators maximize their success. I'm your host, Dr Roxy, founderof Legacy DNA and international bestselling author of how health innovators maximize market success.Through handed conversations with health innovators, earlier doctors and influencers, you'll learn howto bring your innovation from idea to start ups to market domination. And nowlet's jump into the latest episode of Coiq. Welcome back coiq listeners. On today'sepisode I Have Jorge Sanchez with me. He is the CO founder and ChiefMedical Officer for Sentinel. Welcome to the show. Thank you for havingme here, Dr Roxy. So, Jorge, before we get started intoour interview questions, go ahead and give our listeners and viewers a little bitabout your background and what you guys have been innovating lately. Great. Iam eternal medicine trained. I'm act actually hospitals is a doctor to specialize andbeing in the hospital, and I am co founder. Met near off Shaw, or CEO, about three years ago. We talked about talking about remote patientmonitoring and making it clinically feasible and making actually change the outcomes in ourpatients and the story told me he's so you keep seeing patients that were comingwith a pressure with uncontrol, they're coming with strokes. He discharge, theycome back with worst strokes and a blood pressure was still unmanaged. So wethought of this idea of remotely managing hypertensive patients to reduce the risk of strokeand heart attacks. And I initially didn't believe in it and we did astudy in our in our Rehab Facility, and data was so compelling that Ihad to join him in this this this this vision of delivery remote patient care, and then we said, hey, we got to do a company.And then the next question is like how to heck we pay for it?And I then I got introduced a world of entrepreneurship and there's been a wildright since then and we were here. We are talking about remote patient monitoringin the Covid area, which is has totally changed the landscape. Yeah,it will definitely dig into that today. So when did you start the company? Three years ago? Yeah, late two thousand and seventeen, kind oflate towards night two thousand and seventeen. And where are you in the innovationprocess now? So we so it's funny innovation is is is the word that'sthrown around quite a lot. So for innovation for us is see the technologya process, your way of looking at things, and I think actually weknow is that we're we definitely took a stand in innovating and processes in technology. There's this concept of barriers to access to healthcare and I think there's definitelyis a new where, which is technological barriers to health care, and healthcaretraditionally technology is not really accepted. We're...

...warm, with a warm fuzzy feeling, because healthcare, the community as a whole, is very much into evidencebased in a traditional model of a validating any products, any ideas, becausewe're applying this to human beings and our oath is not harm people. Sobefore you have a product or process touch a patient, it has to bea very long period of validation and checks and balance to make sure that doesn'tyou're not harming anybody and that you're also doing some good that's manageable and quantifiable. So what we believe in is that healthcare, because of the distrust oftechnology, it's very hard to get to enter that space of healthcare. Soif your Tech Company to get validation is very difficult. You have to dopilogy of the trilogy, have to publish, and so when we did is wetook a shot at getting our data and we submitted to American Heart Associationand Pear Review was accepted. I presented at San Francisco American Harnet and Igot it was rare. We're very well received and the moment we got that, that pilot under our belt and the validation and data before it, itjust funny. When we talk to customers, which in this case where clinics,it just helped us. It gave us momentum. So the innovation isin the managing hyppertension at Tenex fast and intense standard of care through algorithms andmobile mobile health, and basically patients get up device, the device connects toour APP, which is a mobile Andrew or IOS. The data goes tothe cloud and with the unique thing is that we have algorithms and data analysisthat isolates the patient and we have care team that we train to talk tothe patients monthly, to coach them, track them and if there's any anomalousmeasurements actually get called real timing. By the way, this all happens realtime to day is not side load that day doesn't get put away. Wehave about three hundredzero blood pressure measurements over one thousand five hundred patients on theplatform. It's a we're doing a longitude at all tracking. So the patientswere two thousand and seventeen till today. Is Maybe two and a half yearsof data on patients. So the other innovation is, can we make thedata meaningful so that a a doctor can actually do something about it rather thanjust shows up in his earmar or his phone and Guyem to do something.So the goal is the innovation. Innovation is not enough. You got tohave you got to change something, you got to save money, scale andhelp the patient. And we want to do as those three things. Andwe've done is we just published and again another study in American Heart Association isgoing to be presented in September. We've lowered the blood pressure, average bloodpressure of our groups by a bout four millimeters of mercury. The classes ofhypertension, very severe to mild, have shifted to towards mild, which meansthat our patients are getting healthy from a...

...blood pressure point. And then thethat the that the innovation is that our care team, you know, atthe challenge and healthcare is that one doctor want provided one patients. got akind of change that ratio. We're trying to change our racial work care teamcan manage several hundred patients through the technology that we give them, through theso plastform, through the devices. So so I want to go back tosomething that you said around the the clinical validation in the piloting. You know, from your perspective, has that changed because of Covid? So, priorto Covid, you know I've had guests on the show and we would talka lot about, you know, death by pilot, getting stuck in pilotpurgatory and you know, all the all the best practices around getting that dataand that clinical efficacy and validation that's needed to really be able to successfully commercializeand innovation and healthcare. And then since Covid, you know, where doesthat leave us with these pilots? Have they stopped? Are they are ournew pilots happening? Has that impacted that that type of process? For you, the answers yes, it's definitely has changed the way pilots will allow.But for us, who was an opportunity to right every obstacles, an opportunityto show how good you are. So what the challenge for was was that, because we have to enrolled patients in the pilot, we have to havesomeone in our team be going to clinic and give the patient to blood pressurecoff and the device and train them and educating and showing the APP that there'sthat takes time and you have to do it in person and because of Covidand and it's obviously afraid of having these channgers coming in and having a patientcome in just for device in an area where they're potentially exposed. So wehad to solve that. We did is we did virtual on boarding. Sowe converted. So we solved traditional on boarding and went to virtual on boardingwhere the Chit, the Cup, gets ship to the patient, we callhim. Virtually we helped them, we educate them on how to do thecuff, train them on the cuff, use, download the APP, enrollthem in the APP, give all the permissions. All that has to bedone virtually. So we have to solve a lot of inherent friction points where, if someone isn't usually in front of you and grab your cell phone anddownload something for you, like how do you do the same part of virtuallyand our population is over sixty. There's a cohort that technology has really notbeen very nice to them. So our chief technology officer is amazing. He'svery forward thinking. He's made this stuff work for this population. There's nottechnically challenged. They just did no one has designed work flows for them.So because the way we do it, we're are able to successfully on onboard six five, seventy, seventy five at your old patients onto the platform. And I think that is the council...

...for pilots in the sense of CovidAge. You got to do the pilot and removed that that risk of exposure, and if you do that then the customer is not going to be sohesitant. So I think that's really important because I've talked to people that haveactually put it it and hold and in our kind of way in waiting for, you know, Covid to be done in order to kind of pick up, maybe hopefully, where they left off. And so, you know, Idon't think this is a term that I coined by any means, butI talked a lot about innovation being burst in chaos. Right. You know, in these most crisis moments we can see some of our biggest creativity andand so I would imagine that if you didn't have this limitation, you probablywould have relied on the the physical facetoface model for a long time. Becauseof the crisis, your team got creative on how they could solve this andit could ultimately end up providing a much better experience and much more scalable,right, and that's that's the beauty of this is that, where some peoplewould have thrown their hands up, we really sat there and our engineers inour CTO just sat there and they just buckled down and he solved it andwe're doing good. I mean we're growing that our growth hasn't been impeded byCovid we had a pause, but hasn't been impeded because of this virtual roll. And the other part is we have to point all, when it's acrisis or what I call here on fire, you have your hair on fire,you get the guy bringing water, you're going to get you're going toget attention. So it's also timing because if we had not, we weretoo small and I had the money to be able to order learn the knowledgeto be able to do this, and this happened. We have been deadin the water. So we're a little bit further long. Yeah, theparty is that we realize the pain points and we solve the problems that whenwe talked to the customer and the objections they have, worry kind of twosteps ahead of that's that's a key part. Yeah, yeah, I definitely thinkthat for all leaders, no matter what you're doing, you know,our resilience is being tested and in completely different ways than we have before.So so where you today? What's what are some of the new, newest, latest exciting things that are happening for your company today? And I thinkI also, you know, kind of want it. On top of that, has covid not only not hindered you or, you know, been animpediment, but it all, has it also been an accelerator for you?That's interesting. The so covid didn't come it is just an opportunity for usbecause remote patient monitoring existed before covid. It wasn't really or out of ourcustomers or clinics and hospital systems. But when Covid came along, we threwthis APP into the wild and we have...

...got a lot of attention. Andthen we wanted to build an ecosystem and not just be an APP designer andit just goes out. We wanted to build ecosystem. So our APP connectsto our platform that has the data in the data loops around to some providerin an organized way and it's all decentralized, delocalized. So when we went tocovid and we partnered with, for example, Dell Medical Austin to dotheir contact racing, it wasn't just the APP that tracks the patient ask thesymptoms. The things that I'm pretty sure that people are doing is that webuild contact tracing support on the back end so that the contact tracers, whenthey get this data and track it, they can have someone to follow andit makes sense in its organized way. So it's not just the APP,it's that how the data goes into the platform and the dashboard. So that'swhen, when there's a person working on it, it makes a workflow thatis just fast and like butter and it just makes an even we worked.We work really hard with thell. We customize it and we definitely well oversix thousand patients on that platform. That are being it's ongoing and it whenwe do. What do we learn from that? Is that you can't makea one of you can't make a one of product. You have to buildyour product that's a core product that can be a tool like a legos thatcan connect into different problems and if you presented the product as a covid solution, be people very cynical. But do we prevent it presented as remote patientmonitoring, traditional remote patient monitoring or physiologic monitoring in the context of Covid?It makes more sense. It does. It kind of makes logical sense.You have patients or Covid, they're about to get it. Their risk,you know, you know, higher risk of cardio cardiovascular events. So thereforemonitoring is totally appropriate, totally matches it and people get it. But yetthe end and the end of the day, we were always doing remote patroon monitoring. It didn't it didn't appear like we just came on the scene andinvented remote patroon monitoring for covid. We're doing it for diet, we weredoing it for heart faded, we're doing for hypotension, we're doing for abunch of other things. So I think that's the key point here, thatjust have a good core product, that and a good service, and everythingwill follow, everything will rule, people will look for it. Hey,it's Dr Roxy here with a quick break from the conversation. Are you tryingto figure out what moves you need to make to survive and thrive in thenew covid economy? I want every health innovator to find their most viable andprofitable pivot strategy, which is why I created the covid prove Your Business TivotKit. The pivot hit is a step by step framework that helps you findyour best pivot strategy. It walks you through six categories you me to examinefor a three hundred and sixty degree view of your business. I call themthe six critical pivot lenses. As you...

...make your way through this comprehensive kit, you'll be armed with the tools, tips and strategies you need to makesure you can pivot with speed without missing out on critical details and opportunities.Learn more at legacy type and DNACOM backslash kit. I think that what you, you know, just described is a dilemma across or cross roads that alot of health innovators have found themselves amidst this crisis. Is Is I hada really viable solution prior to covid. It has a use case for COVID. But do I change my positioning strategy or my messaging strategy? How doI do that around Covid to make sure that I don't seem like exactly likeyou said, so I don't seem like I'm just this new company on thescenes, but I also don't miss any opportunity for these specific new use casesthat have come since the the pandemic. What were some of those considerations thatyou all made out of guy? So we did is, we did youknow, we did testing, we pie of we threw it on your whilethey looked at the responsive. We didn't pivot. We were not ready topivot. We don't consider a pivot. So I think that if your company, in Your Corp, you're talking about making a pivot to covid nineteen,that's a big commitment. We predate covid will be around, but in whatform we don't know, and that's a pretty big risk for company to makea pivot like that. I think that if you you you stay the courseand you micro pivot that's far safer than if you make a total because you'reabandoning. Think about you. You are two year, let's say Ypathet yourtwo years start up. You're almost abandoned one and a half years of workfor something that is there. By the way, everybody's jumping on a solutionfor Colle Right. Everybody gets email. Your healthcare, you get emails thatare like Hey, what's going to happen in Post Covid? This is what'syour covid nineteen solution. Right then, is becoming a rubber stamp on everything. So now you want to be the company that is adding to the noiseout there. Right there are you. The only way you're going to getsignals you have to show a product market fit, and the only way goingto show that you have to have a core product that has a proven historyof success in the past because, as you know, in healthcare, youknow, these are not emotional decisions. These are very logical. There's morestakeholder, is more people involved. Your product has to be scrutinized by morepeople. By if, let's say, it's to clinic, is not thedoctor's own is got to be the practice manager, it's got to be thebiller. It's got to be everybody's got a stake in even the patients haveto have a stake in it. If you're in a hospital system, theCIO has to have a say in it, the IT department has to say init. You know, legal has to have a saying that. Theunit economics have to make sense. So if you're going to pivot, you'retotally taking your like my CEO near up says, it's like, you know, we're making a seven layer cake. You're throwing all those layers out andnow you're making brand new layers. You better have a good foundation and that'sjust not it's not a good way to go. Yeah, if you're failingand you're drowning in the weeds and you're not and in your that route,then maybe that's the Bible way to go,...

...but I don't, I don't.I don't think that that is the way to go. If you havea stable you're making money or you're growing slowly, I wouldn't I would havepivot to to cold. Yeah, definitely don't think it's a one size fitsall. I think every organization, you know, I think the ones thatare probably best suited for the pivot, that they would have been best suitedfor the pivot prior to covid that they just write they didn't have a viablemarket strategy and the the pandemic just be just illuminates that more so than maybethey were paying attention to before. Yeah, totally. And I think that whenyou're when you're in the you're in the weeds and your fight, you'rein the mud fighting, it's hard to get an assessment of yourself as acompany. When you now you got all those noise around. You're like,what kind of you have to ask yourself. We have to ask us what kindof company are we are we have service, all we tech, awe idea. We delivering what exactly were doing? And once you identify yourself, then like how you branding it, and in the brand becomes self fulfillingprophecy. Right, you, you just can't, like you say in yourbook that I read it, you can't be a logo. It's how uniqueyou make your company in the context of the market so that you stand apartfrom everybody else. Right, if you're everybody else, logos are orange andyou change it the purple, it's not going to make a difference. Everybodyis serving one community and they're serving everybody that maybe it's time for you toserve one specific niche rather than everyone else. You can't look like everyone else.And that's the end. And it's weird because, like, are youchanging because of your competition? Are you changing because of your vision? AndI think that's where, for me, the team, the founding team orthe court team, is so key, which I'm very proud of my company, because our team is just amazing and I think that that is why we'rewe're just still survived, surviving and perseverating and flourishing in the middle of covidbecause if the team has a vision and the vision is there, you canrelay it to your customers, to your patients, to your team's to everyoneyou touch. It becomes part of your DNA and in there the brand flourishes. Our CTR CEO New York, he's his superpower is that he relays hisvision and he can communicate that vision very clearly, and that to me isa key, key superpowered that unique CEO's have to have from the common oryou have a spectacular product, but if you seeo can't relay that vision inthe context of the ecosystem you're creating, because you could. You could eitherbe so my thing is if you're a small company, you just you're goingto be low in the ecosystem, or I find but if you're low inthe ecosystem, you're at the mercy of everybody above you. But how youget to the top is you have to relay a vision that you are creatinga new ecosystem and that you want to be the top of them. Andthen now you're rocking and wrong, because...

...now everybody will follow you and everybodywill see it and your partner better. You have more alliances. People willsee that they can interact with you better benefit from you, which is whatwe're doing. We have partnerships with different companies, partnership with universities doing research, all because we are vision of our product, of our service, isthat we are providing an end to end solution for remote patient monitoring that isnot just focused on the service. It's focus on the technology, it's focuson the liquidity of data is, it's focusing on the patient adherents, it'sfocusing on outcomes, it's Focun focusing and agility. It's focusing on scalability andcost. When you put all those together, you better have a good story toto do that. Otherwise you just going to fall flat in your facewhen you when you, when you can execute. So, speaking of that, you know, and I love when folks like you come on the showthat are open to being so candid and transparent about the realities of this journey. Right. So it's not. It's not just rainbows and butterflies every stepof the way. And just when, when win, win, win.So what are you know, for the viewers and listeners that are hearing yourstory, what are some of the the challenges that you either have faced duringcovid or that you're facing today, so that they may be learned from thator reinspired riot right, I think the biggest challenge is because now we're delocalizedand we don't have facetoface the community, the quality of communication has been suburbbefore. We used to fly me and talking. Now we have to dofacetoface and you know, some of it's done while you're driving were, whileyou're shopping the supermarket and you're pushing the cart and your daughter's jumping on aroundyou, and you know grabbing an open stuff up. So, because ofcovid real real life encroaches on your job, because there's no barriers right. It'slike I can't lock a door and keep my daughter out, and Iwould want that. So I think the biggest challenge is to have to keepyour team, have have the vision, relay that vision and meet You keepyour team motivated, yeah, so that they see the vision also and they'reexcited about what you have. Also this thing about remote, monetary remote employment. It's not what it's cut out to be. You know, the peoplesay it's a great Gig, but they don't realize that you don't know whenyou're out. They start, you don't know when you're end. The End. There's a lot of gray area. This the job satisfaction pulled down infront of a computer you're talking about. They were meeting you. Just gottayou just got to relay that to your team, that remote, remote work. You're not being measured by the hours that you put in, is bythe quality of your work. So it's just a different metric and a differentmindset and I think that that if you're not a company of your company,that in the Covid is your dd you...

...have a delocalized team. Like Isay, you have to talk to them differently, you have to motivate themdifferently, you have to talk to them more often and again to the day. You got to refresh the division, because you could be you could seeyou like you're not. My company's over, I think over fifty people are workingin their company. It's a headcount. If you're by yourself calling patients everyday and you don't talk to anybody, you see alone, you feel likeyou're not part of a big yeah, the challenge is, how do youyou got to make your people feel like they're part of a very largeidea even though they're at home by themselves with nobody to talk to social andI think that is the keep think of, keep working at yeah, I thinkthat there's there's enough. So, besides the additional resilience that's required,I think that there are different tools that have to be in the leadership toolboxin order to be an effective virtual leader, because it's not the same tool set. So can you think of any, you know, just really tangible examplesof how you are leading a virtual team differently than you've maybe would havedone in the facetoface environment, anything that's working well to kind of cultivate thatrelationship long distance. The the definite the definite Bundo or lever that we're pushingis we worked the team. We make sure that the team leaders understand andwe all work together. We communicate together. So if the team gels and theteam understands the problems and solve it, then I won't have to jump inin micromanage it or get involved. So I think the team, thecohesive of the team, the unity of the team, every marching shoulder shoulderto the same goal is very key, and then everything else aligned with that. So when we get on phone calls, my focus with problems is not whatthe actual problem is is. I look around the virtual room, we'regoing to call it, and look at how my team is solving and inmy focus is, hey, have you tried this or that to solve thisproblem? Not to I want you to. I want you to call a Band C. I try not to do that because then the the persondoesn't feel validated, they don't feel like they're part of the solution, andthen the next time a similar problems problem comes up, they won't be ableto they will be able to solve it. It'll calling you again, emailing youagain. Yeah, definitely. That empowerment is really important. So,as you think about your journey for the last three years, what decisions doyou think that you all have made that have just been game changers for youto to get you to the sixth level of success that you're at today?Well, it's so weird. It's actually a lot of little decisions that backthen didn't seem like little and now he...

...like wow, man, that wasa good decision. You know, and I tell my CEO while we're luckyand he says no, we weren't lucky. We just had enough data and weconnected the bast the right way, and I think the the the decisionthat we have made is to opt for the vision and stick to our visionrather than other other people convinced it's otherwise. We've been, I mean, I'vebeen kicked out of I mean I've been, you know, and overin Miami we've been mean and near over my CEO we first started. Wewere kicked out of cardiology, we were kicked out of rooms because they couldn'tbelieve that stroke patients could use a phone APP. We were. We wereconvinced that that doesn't make sense. It does. Yeah, older people douse the phones. They're do it. The point is, we stuck toin there and investors, some investors, would tells like, Hey, youneed to pivot. It is you need to pivot is with the markets,those and this and that, and you just get so many you just getso many confounders. They the end of the day, someone tells you togo north and no one tell you go south. And I went to theWest East in a day. You know, I talked to my CEO and welike doing. We got what is the vision? We're going to doremote patient monitoring the way we're going to do it, the way we envisionit, which is we listened but we speak. That's why we picked thename Sentinel. We listen the data, we also manage and we come outmanager and take the risk of managing patients. And we stuck to it. Peopletell like that's very risky, that's for there's a lot of liability andat the end of the day, you just have to stick to your visionand make it a reality, and that's the magical bubble that you have tohave. You have to be so convincing that it's a possibility. The possibilityis not a possibility, it's a it's it's a reality, and I thinkthat that is the decision that we it's just basically the attitude. Well,we're going to do remote patient monitoring this way, this is the way webelieve, it is the way they should work and stick to it and havethe vision and but have evidence to back of your visit. The difference betweenand hallucination is very it's very it's very thin line of a vision of hallucination. So it's exactly where I was going next for hey is there's this fineline for entrepreneurs, between investors and cardiology teams. You know, we're kickingme out and they're saying you're crazy and that won't work, and I'm andI'm being stubborn in my vision because I know it will and it can.And then also where the flip side of that is, you know, listeningto advice and hearing what the data and in being able to recognize that maybemy original vision or idea is not going to leave me to product market fit. And how are you dancing around those two parallel paths where one leads tosuccess and the other one leads to fail. Your totally not a totally. Imean you, we could have pivoted and me we committed to early,too small clinics to you know, because there were the earlier doctors and thathelped us validate the idea. But the...

...earlier doctors also weren't was it financiallyviable for other reasons. So now the early adopters who validated us, nowwe're allowed us to go to the middle adoptors and now we're approaching their laterdoctors. So the the you got to have data and you got to lookat it objective and look at your company and and keep you very the wayit's are you ready to kill your baby to make it fly right? Likeyou this idea that you have. You really believe in it. You haveto be willing to take the risk and let it die so they can validatebecause if if you don't have you know what I and I've been to alot of incomputers. Here's what I see. A Lot I see people would ortech. They have an idea, it's a beautiful idea underhead. Theyhave the technology, they're in love with the technology. Oh I have thismembrane that there's magical properties. I have this device that does this, Ihave this APP that does this in your face and this in that beautiful.But can you make that in healthcare, in the context of healthcare? Canyou address an illness? Can you change the outcome of their owners and canyou lower the cost? And that is the part that everybody forgets. Soyou have these engineers come up with these beautiful ideas that become orphans. Yeah, no, I saw a company that gave us this device that goes aroundyour neck to a beautiful device, but you can't. It doesn't up,it doesn't work, it doesn't apply. There's no applicable scenario, clinical scenariothat it would change the outcome. So I think that I take taken wherewe're in love or technology. Could your product market fit? Has To solvea problem that's measurable, Palpable and in effects and touches everybody. The patienthas to benefit, the doctor has to benefit, your company has to beenat, society has to benefit. And if you don't start with that andthen do the technology second, you're going to create a product that does youknow it. You know it makes me buzzes and wizes but doesn't really changeanything. And it is that, then, what I call the Zombie graveyard?Yeah, yeah, absolutely. So, as we wrap up here, doyou have any lessons learned that you would want to share with our viewersand listeners? Lessons learned? Number One, pilots. You shouldn't call pilots.I think a pilot puts you in a position where you're doing work forfree and your customer is not really convinced. I we start. We stopped doingpilots because you just we were getting stuck in the expectation word. Managedso do it early, do a control of roll out. So the ideais do a pilot with the condition that if the pilot succeeds and there's metrics, they're going to sign it at that and you're going to grow into acustomer. But if you do a pilot with uncleared metrics, unclear goals andthey're not going to sign in the on, then that partner, that's not apilot. It's not going to it's not to help, even to wastemany resources and even to have nothing to show for it. That's number one. Number two is don't worry too much about branding at the beginning. Thebranding will come naturally if you'd make all...

...the right decisions. If you reachthe earlier doctors, they'll be your brand. They'll brand for you because if youget the earlier doctors and you target for the earlier doctors and you makethings easy for them and they sign up for you, now they become casestudy that you can show the middle adoptors in the lad a doctors. Thelater doctors are the guys who are not taking risk right. It's like inlike a bull fight. The earlier doctors are in the in the up inthe stands. They want to see what they can do and if they seeit's safe, they're going to go into the into into the bull ring withyou. The earlier doctors are the guys in the ring with you. They'retaking the risk, but you're also taking risk and you gotta, you gotta, you gotta mitigate that risk as best you can, because they know thatthey're taking risk and you know your earlier a doctor. So I think thatif you take a strategy earlier doctors, focus on them, you'll do muchbetter in your survive a long away and then on a day to day basis. You know, being a being in a entrepreneur is not what it's cutout to be. It's not as glamorous. If People May, I talk tomy team. I'm on the phone, you know, hours a day,multiple some are thirty seconds, some are forty five minutes long. Itcan be very exhausting. There's a lot of face earlier. There's a lotof small failures that can make you very desponded and I think that you justdon't you can do is walk away with a sense that you learned something fromthat and change the same change the attitude, change the way you see things,stay with your vision, communicate with your team and me and my mywe have two models in my in my company is what is we we eatfaded for for for breakfast and last times. I continue everybody's we're going to seeAmerica patient of the time that goes. Wait, wait, I think we'vegot some noise going on. I didn't get a chance to hear that. If you want to repeat that, is that coming? Is that meor you? I think that's you. It stopped. So all right.She want to repeat that? You eat failure. You eat failure for bran. Yeah, so we have the sayings in whenever we have something. Youknow, never've always tells me, hey, we break we'd fader for breakfast.So by lunch time we just have to get over and move on andhave a plan. In the morning we always talk about our faders and whathappened? Didner? Happened in by lunch time, you know, I walkaround the backyard and look at this guy and I'm again, that's it isit is a mistake we made. Is we learn. Let's move on andlet's get back on a horse and do it. Yeah, and then theother the other one is my I say this to everybody, every customer,every patient, every doctor that I speak to is like hey, we're sayingwe're saving America one patient at a time. Got It, you gotta. Yougot to have an end goal in the goal is to you got todo something, that it's going to help society, that you're doing something tohelp people change the world art. With that, you always going to feelgood. If you start with I got to make money, you're not goingto do it because you're not. Your...

...rewards are not going to match thework to you do. Yeah, Yep, absolutely. So thank you so muchfor today for joining me on the show. Today. How do ourlisteners and viewers get ahold of you if they want to follow up with youafter great? My email is very easy. It's sent to know. Actually it'sForr Hey Jorge at sent an old dot healthcare, semti and El Dothealthcare, but our website and we're easy to find. Awesome. Thank youso much. They much appreciate it. Stay healthy. You have a goodone. Great. Thank you so much for listening. I know you're busyworking to bring your life changing innovation to market and I value your time andyour attention. To save time and get the latest episodes on your mobile device, automatically subscribe to the show on your favorite podcast APP like apple podcast,spotify and stitcher. Thank you for listening and I appreciate everyone who's been sharingthe show with friends and colleagues. See You on the next episode of Coiq.

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